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- aaddrryyss
- Member Since: 14 Oct 2019
- Location: Bucharest
- Posts: 3
DieselRanger wrote:
I think LR's traction control is more intelligent than a mid-2K's pure viscous coupling. They reduce throttle and let the brake lock on the spinning wheel and then gradually let power back on once the traction has been established. Once the torque path is established it's not 1:1 power transfer left to right any more.
I still wager that unless you're climbing Ben Nevis on a daily basis the wear due to traction control and grit in off-road situations is going to be orders of magnitude less than the wear due to brake-biased cornering assistance and just keeping the big brute pointed straight in daily motorway driving, if only because of the ratio of time spent in one situation vs. the other.
...only reporting from experience...
I attached some photos for reference. You can see what the suspension needed to do, what the car was navigating through and the muddy view form the interior of the cockpit (in two flavors...plain_muddy and snow_muddy...with a tractor pulling, to mark the end of a sour day
)
On the day these images were taken, the rear brake pads were about 6000 km "old". They were original Land Rover parts. I reached home with deep grooves in the steel of my rear brake rotors, caused by metal_on_metal friction. The brake pad material was...well...nonexistent at that point.
The dash did illuminate warning about the brake pads reaching the end of their usable lifetime, but I was like..."well...and what do you want me to do, given the circumstances...??? Shut up and keep terrain_responding..."
I really do believe a rear locker would have been a helpful addition at that point.
L.E. the posted images don't seem to appear, although "uploading to server" did reach 100% and reported success.
I'm pretty new around here, I'll go back to the basics and read terms and conditions and see if there's something I may have missed about permissions and whatnot.
Later LE: There seems to be no restriction for me to upload photos. I used Firefox originally (under Windows10). Tried Chrome and behavior changes a bit, it goes to 100% and then says Error uploading to gallery. Out of ideas...
Even later LE: thanks Labbix, pics finally went through, following your advice.
Last edited by aaddrryyss on 20th Oct 2019 11:02 am. Edited 1 time in total -
- Labbix
- Member Since: 05 Mar 2018
- Location: Tanzania
- Posts: 955
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- Road Runner 2017
- Member Since: 14 Jan 2017
- Location: Scotland
- Posts: 2010
I was picking the LR instructor's brains yesterday, with regards to the rear locking diff.
Is it worth it for someone like me??
In a nutshell, no !!
The car is more than capable without it, just using the various settings, rock, gravel, mud etc, for normal, light too medium offroading,
However if your into serious off roading or your daily towing a maxxed out trailer full of livestock uphill, through muddy fields, deep water and rocky terrain, then it will definitely be an advantage.
Everyday driving for Joe Bloggs, cars more than capable, but for Farmer Giles, it may well be a life saver, and worth its weight in gold.
Incidentally the rear diff on the car we were taking around the course was making a hell of banging noise. Appears it had got damaged recently somehow, and was the first one that they have had damaged he said. It's still working fine he assured me
MY17 First Edition - 3L Diesel Td6 - Farallon Black - Roof rails,side steps,tints,tow bar,mudflaps,door strips.
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- mordred1973
- Member Since: 08 Jan 2019
- Location: Northamptonshire
- Posts: 758
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- Labbix
- Member Since: 05 Mar 2018
- Location: Tanzania
- Posts: 955
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- gavinadams
- Member Since: 25 Nov 2018
- Location: Sydney
- Posts: 103
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- JonM
- Member Since: 30 Jun 2016
- Location: North Yorkshire
- Posts: 598
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- Labbix
- Member Since: 05 Mar 2018
- Location: Tanzania
- Posts: 955
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- Road Runner 2017
- Member Since: 14 Jan 2017
- Location: Scotland
- Posts: 2010
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mordred1973 wrote:
interesting, I know of 2 ex LRE Scotland cars, one of which had a banging rear diff too.....and JLR declined to replace the rear diff saying there wasn't anything wrong with it.
Well funnily enough that's what the trainer told me too. They reported it too the LR garage and
they told them it's fine, and just keep driving it until it breaks, then it will get replaced
I forgot to mention the instructor told me that they are also replacing brake pads at around 4k on cars with the rear locker, but without the rear diff replacing at 2k.
(I think I have that the right way around. Was alot of techie stuff I was getting told).
Last edited by Road Runner 2017 on 20th Oct 2019 3:36 pm. Edited 1 time in total
MY17 First Edition - 3L Diesel Td6 - Farallon Black - Roof rails,side steps,tints,tow bar,mudflaps,door strips.
MY18 Hse Luxury - 3L Petrol Si6 Supercharged - Santorini Black - Roof rails,side steps,tints,tow bar,mudflaps,door strips,22's,dynamic pack 1,bonnet vents,t.v,dual view,frontcooler,360°camera,rear cooler/warmer,roof vane,black LR badges,wade sensing,door sill plates,boot liner, solar screen,wind deflectors,service plan,tracker,speed camera detector,dual dash cameras,ceramic coating. -
- Labbix
- Member Since: 05 Mar 2018
- Location: Tanzania
- Posts: 955
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- Labbix
- Member Since: 05 Mar 2018
- Location: Tanzania
- Posts: 955
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Ah, now it makes sense
but still VERY early to change the pads... -
- Road Runner 2017
- Member Since: 14 Jan 2017
- Location: Scotland
- Posts: 2010
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Was an average of 4.5k to be exact.
Yes I thought that too, but the cars must take one hell of a beating, as the tracks are very steep, especially downhill.
Tried getting a full day, but so much demand, as they are so busy. Not to mention all the small stones and grit and debris getting caught up between the pads when transversing the deep water areas, damaging the pads and rotors.
So it's understandable that the cars are munching through the pads
MY17 First Edition - 3L Diesel Td6 - Farallon Black - Roof rails,side steps,tints,tow bar,mudflaps,door strips.
MY18 Hse Luxury - 3L Petrol Si6 Supercharged - Santorini Black - Roof rails,side steps,tints,tow bar,mudflaps,door strips,22's,dynamic pack 1,bonnet vents,t.v,dual view,frontcooler,360°camera,rear cooler/warmer,roof vane,black LR badges,wade sensing,door sill plates,boot liner, solar screen,wind deflectors,service plan,tracker,speed camera detector,dual dash cameras,ceramic coating. -
- DieselRanger
- Member Since: 12 Oct 2017
- Location: God's Country, Colorado
- Posts: 768
aaddrryyss wrote:
...only reporting from experience...
I attached some photos for reference. You can see what the suspension needed to do, what the car was navigating through and the muddy view form the interior of the cockpit (in two flavors...plain_muddy and snow_muddy...with a tractor pulling, to mark the end of a sour day )
On the day these images were taken, the rear brake pads were about 6000 km "old". They were original Land Rover parts. I reached home with deep grooves in the steel of my rear brake rotors, caused by metal_on_metal friction. The brake pad material was...well...nonexistent at that point.
The dash did illuminate warning about the brake pads reaching the end of their usable lifetime, but I was like..."well...and what do you want me to do, given the circumstances...??? Shut up and keep terrain_responding..."
I really do believe a rear locker would have been a helpful addition at that point.
That does look like an extreme situation, would think there would be plenty of opportunity for grit and small stones to get caught between the pad and rotors such that you're always picking up new grit and sweeping it between the pad and rotor over the rotor surface even if you're not using the brakes. Recall also the D4 is about 800lbs heavier than the D5, so that's a lot more mass to slow down even when you're moving slowly, so any application of brakes results in pressing the grit hard against the rotor and pad surface, and it's is going to cause issues if you do it long enough and don't have "clean" water to drive through to wash the pads and rotors.
A rear locker certainly would have made driving through that muck easier. If you do it regularly, I'd say that you're going to get a ton of wear no matter whether you have a rear locker or not. But the D5 with a center locker, low range, mud/ruts mode, and ESC off can handle that without much drama. -
- DieselRanger
- Member Since: 12 Oct 2017
- Location: God's Country, Colorado
- Posts: 768
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Labbix wrote:
Ah, now it makes sense but still VERY early to change the pads...
I think they also use the HDC on all of their downhills, which is all brakes. I, for one, always turn mine off - if it's steep enough to use the HDC, then it's steep enough to engage the low range, put it in manual mode, and let the engine and transfer box do the work. In 1st gear, anything that doesn't require my left foot bracing me back in my seat requires me to actually use the accelerator to move it downhill. -
- Road Runner 2017
- Member Since: 14 Jan 2017
- Location: Scotland
- Posts: 2010
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Yes we were using the hill descent control mostly on the downhill parts.
Just a pity, as I would have liked to have tried the more demanding parts of the course, without the rear locker engaged, just to see that difference, but the car made easy work with the diff lock engaged.
Was a really good day with lots of informative stuff, and really appreciate what the cars full potential is
Last edited by Road Runner 2017 on 20th Oct 2019 4:04 pm. Edited 1 time in total
MY17 First Edition - 3L Diesel Td6 - Farallon Black - Roof rails,side steps,tints,tow bar,mudflaps,door strips.
MY18 Hse Luxury - 3L Petrol Si6 Supercharged - Santorini Black - Roof rails,side steps,tints,tow bar,mudflaps,door strips,22's,dynamic pack 1,bonnet vents,t.v,dual view,frontcooler,360°camera,rear cooler/warmer,roof vane,black LR badges,wade sensing,door sill plates,boot liner, solar screen,wind deflectors,service plan,tracker,speed camera detector,dual dash cameras,ceramic coating.
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