- J77
- Member Since: 07 Jun 2016
- Location: Fife
- Posts: 1008
Yeah that’s the one.
18MY Velar R-Dynamic SE D240 Fuji White
- neilk
- Member Since: 12 Aug 2016
- Location: Wokingham
- Posts: 137
Topix Bulletin says the fix is on hold and being developed for D5 which suggests the problem is different with the engine installation.
Bulletins also on the deployable shelf (the operating bracket shears) which happened to mine and leaves it sitting flat ( it also stops the tailgate opening from the key)
They also seem to have had a problem with the tow bar folding away unintentionally and have a software upgrade and a bezel to fit around the button to stop things in the boot pressing the button. This could well have been the cause of the reports of the bar snapping off.
Still keen to see what the final real world service interval will be.
- Francesco
- Member Since: 27 Sep 2017
- Location: Modena
- Posts: 10
I keep my post.
After the computer had dropped to less than 900 km to change oil, despite having traveled only about 7,000, and be traced back to 4000 km, yesterday after I had traveled about 100 km to go for a trek in the mountains in the snow (sun and fresh snow: wonderful) and as many to go down to the plains, the computer indicates that at the oil change are missing over 6,600 km. In total I have traveled about 8,000 km.
and 6.660 Km would be needed for oil change. In other words. If I use the Discovery for short journeys, the interval for oil changes is drastically reduced; if instead I make longer trips, the interval increases a lot. So I do not think it's an oil dilution problem but a wrong method of measuring the oil change interval.
Greetings to all
First edition farralon black
- Ed Snow
- Member Since: 28 Nov 2017
- Location: Norwich
- Posts: 79
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All those of you experiencing or having experienced early ad blue top ups and or oil changes, can I just ask are you using standard supermarket fuels or shell vpower or bp ultimate? Just wondering if using the 'cleaner' fuels will help resolve the problem....
- DieselRanger
- Member Since: 12 Oct 2017
- Location: God's Country, Colorado
- Posts: 766
Diesel in the US is all ULSD. The only difference between retail points of sale here is in additives for things like cetane, shelf life, anti-microbial properties, and lubricity.
- J77
- Member Since: 07 Jun 2016
- Location: Fife
- Posts: 1008
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Ed Snow wrote:
All those of you experiencing or having experienced early ad blue top ups and or oil changes, can I just ask are you using standard supermarket fuels or shell vpower or bp ultimate? Just wondering if using the 'cleaner' fuels will help resolve the problem....
I use the bog standard Shell fuel, as I have done with all previous LRs. My one had early service warning but it disappeared by the time it went into dealers. They didn’t deem an oil change necessary, despite LR saying that it should be carried out. Currently it’s showing 3500 miles to service, that should see me to March, IF, it doesn’t drop drastically.
18MY Velar R-Dynamic SE D240 Fuji White
- Ed Snow
- Member Since: 28 Nov 2017
- Location: Norwich
- Posts: 79
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Hi Jimbg, I have read a copy although must admit I did skim through it a little. I understand it is due various things including the car software, but the crux of the matter as I saw it was due to over fuelling to trigger the dpf cleaning process, and it is this excess fuel that then goes into the oil. Surely if the fuel is cleaner and produces les soot the dpf will not be so clogged up and hence wil not need to go into re-burn so often? Certainly I find that now with my current D4 (MY13 non ad-blue). ie use cheap fuel it goes into re-burn after about 400 miles where as on good fuel it only does after about 800-1200 miles... i.e. Every tank full or every 2 -3 tanks.
Hence wondered if anyone with this D5 issue had seen any differences with fuel.
- jimbg
- Member Since: 23 Jun 2016
- Location: Devon
- Posts: 1472
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I now see where you are coming from but I am not sure fuel quality is that major a factor?
- DieselRanger
- Member Since: 12 Oct 2017
- Location: God's Country, Colorado
- Posts: 766
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WARNING: Pure speculation informed only by available documentation. I am not a diesel powertrain engineer.
So based on @jimbg 's post of the bulletin and @Francesco 's experience, it's still not clear to me whether there's true dilution happening up to the 6.1% limit before the oil service indicator lights up.
Reason: the bulletin states that there may be incomplete regen occurring on short trips. In other words, there's a measured amount of fuel necessary to clear the DPF once it reaches some state of fullness, and a cycle will be started when differential pressure across the DPF is above some threshold, indicating it's full. It also appears that the vehicle calculates diesel dilution by counting the number of regen cycles. However, does it calculate dilution based on completed cycles or started cycles? When does the counter increment? Does it only count whole cycles?
Let's say for sake of example a regeneration cycle is half-way done when it's interrupted, and the differential pressure across the DPF is still above the threshold for regeneration. If the counter increments on the start of a regeneration cycle and only counts whole cycles, and that cycle is interrupted causing the cycle to re-start on the next drive, then it's possible that it's counting more cycles than are completed and there's less dilution occurring than calculated. In that case, the oil is actually OK - because it's counting half-completed cycles as a full cycle, but less fuel has been post-injected than over the course of a full cycle. This would be what I would expect, assuming there's no direct measurement of oil viscosity to determine oil dilution directly. This would be excellent news, because I really don't want my engine to fail the month after my warranty expires, which we all know is when major failures happen. In that case, a software update to more accurately calculate oil life including partial DPF regeneration cycles is in order. EDIT: the relation to distance until next service would be calculated by the average number of miles between regeneration cycles, projected forward. So Francesco's experience where he likely completed a full regeneration on his long journey and observed his "distance to next service" increase might lend evidence to this theory.
If the counter increments on completed cycles, then there's a danger that dilution would happen much faster than the counter would increment, putting the engine in danger of early failure. I have to believe that the engineers with Ford/PSA and JLR would have taken this into account. This doesn't seem to match the pattern we're seeing. Many short trips would actually result in most vehicles reaching their stated service interval, possibly with indicated oil life left. The regen cycle would rarely finish during a trip and the counter would rarely increment, yet post-injection would be happening a lot thus diluting the engine oil.
- jimbg
- Member Since: 23 Jun 2016
- Location: Devon
- Posts: 1472
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I have just checked Topix and can no longer find the various versions of the Oil Dilution fix, have they been removed or am I just not looking in the right place?
- neilk
- Member Since: 12 Aug 2016
- Location: Wokingham
- Posts: 137
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It seems to have been removed. I looked last week and the bulletin that said the update was on temporary hold for the D5, and the bulletin that described the update itself are both no longer there.
- neilk
- Member Since: 12 Aug 2016
- Location: Wokingham
- Posts: 137
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On the supermarket fuel vs standard diesel debate I know different views exist. Premium unleaded does have a higher octane rating and I use it by choice in my Elise. The case for diesel in my view is less clear cut as even the manufacturers make fairly vague claims like “our best detergent formula ever”. My view is that it is 90% marketing and 10% value but I do understand that the majors are likely to have better quality control and ensure no contamination in their tanks than an independent discounter in a back street garage. Others and those running larger fleets than mine swear by it, but I do think that the big supermarket outlets are going to have simlarly high standards. Best independent reviews I can find suggest running the odd tankful may be enough to get a benefit rather than religiously using it every time.
Specifically for the DPF/Regen issue it may or may not make a difference but the point is the service interval is based on using fuel that meets the Relevant standards and that is what the car should perform with.
- J77
- Member Since: 07 Jun 2016
- Location: Fife
- Posts: 1008
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Well service warning back on again, this time 1050 miles to go, last time 1700 miles. It’s probably less than 1000 miles since it was last in for the same issue.
So another trip to the dealers
18MY Velar R-Dynamic SE D240 Fuji White
